Introduction (: 00:06

Welcome to the Better Than Bitter Divorce Podcast, where we flip the script on divorce and show you how to have a more amicable divorce resolution. I'm your host, Tania Leichliter a divorce coach, a certified life coach, and the mastermind behind the Better Than Bitter five-step game plan course, where I help individuals build a pathway towards a more amicable divorce resolution.

Each week, I'll bring you uplifting stories from people who've successfully experienced amicable separations, proving that divorce doesn't have to be a battleground. Whether you're overwhelmed with grief, struggling with custody and co-parenting, or just dealing with a high-conflict individual, this podcast is here to guide you towards reclaiming your life and being what I know is possible, better than bitter.

Tania Leichliter (: 01:17

Welcome to the Better Than Bitter Podcast, episode number 46. So you're still living under the same roof. Transition planning. Today, this is going to be a unique podcast. I'm going to give you clips from one of my support groups of me coaching individuals live. I'm not going to be sharing any of the participants' voices.

But what I am going to do is commentate in between the live coaching on the topics that we are discussing and the challenges and obstacles that individuals face during this transition plan as they're beginning to move into their legal process. And I'm hoping that the legal process is mediation. So listen closely as I talk about living under the same roof.

and how to develop a transition plan that gives you the space as well as your children, as you begin to think about the legal process.

Tania Leichliter (: 02:13

The first topic we discussed in our support group was transition planning, moving into mediation, and what to discuss first. Each of you is going to have different ideas on what you want to cover in that mediation process in each of the sessions. One person might want to start with custody. The other person might want to start with the home and asset division. But there's always different pieces of each of those

that need to get some clarity. So if you feel that you are not aligned moving into what you want to discuss going forward in mediation, there are ways for you to both get what you want in the process. Part of that process is around how you communicate with each other in that initial decision-making. So, what we are going to cover at the beginning of this episode is active listening.

And what that means is that when somebody comes forward and says, I want to talk about custody or I want to talk about the home, and you might respond with, Well, I really want to talk about our living situation now, getting better clarity on what that actually means for each person. So what does it mean when someone says, I want to start with the home or what does it mean when someone starts with custody?

Because the bottom line is, if you're struggling with living under the same roof right now, well, custody and the home both fall under that category. So if somebody doesn't want to talk about the transition or where you are in the moment, living under the same roof, and they don't want to start there. Guess what? A piece of that is custody. is parenting plans.

The other piece of that does have to do with the home. You're both living in the home. And before you actually get divorced, you have to figure out how the home is going to be used in that separation process.

Who's going to live in the home? If you're going to be living in the home. So again, these topics that are the bigger, broader topics, home, assets, custody, they all have a piece in this transition plan.

So finding a way to get what you want as well as what your soon-to-be ex wants is something we are going to work towards. So listen to my live coaching during this support group as we work through some of these issues.

(: 04:45

You don't want to start with our living conditions. I'm not quite understanding what a non-starter means. Can you be clearer so I can make sure I understand?

because that's a strange response to that. That's a non-starter. Well, how am I supposed to interpret that? So can you expand? Ultimately, that was very attacky, right? That he came back to. So, the most important thing when someone comes back with a response like that, you just need to check for understanding.

What I hear you saying is X. Is that how I should be interpreting it, or can you expand on what the meaning of that is?

I'm just trying to get clarity on what non non-starter means. Non-starters like you don't want to start there, or that we're not

going to come up with a resolution for our housing at this point. Just in a real inquisitive way, instead of a threatening way, you're trying to understand. Can you explain why?

You're just trying to get deeper into understanding what's going on in his head, because he doesn't get to dictate where you start. He doesn't. And you said, OK, house. And he said, custody and house. So what I hear you saying is that you want to start with who gets the house as an asset. And custody,

Are we talking about physical custody? Are we talking legal custody? Or you just want to talk about parenting plans? These are all very defined, different subject matters that will all have to be discussed. So the house could be a near-term housing agreement, where, who's going to live in the house today? It could be who's going to own the house, or what are we going to do with the house?

There are lots of things, but you're not going to be able to cover all of those topics in one session, right? So let's drill it down. And you'd be like, hey, we only have an hour. So we're going to need to drill down a little, or two hours. We're going to really need to drill down. So when you say home, part of that home conversation could be transition planning. And so when you say non-starter, you don't want to start with transition planning. You want to start with what we're going to

do with the home. Just trying to check for understanding here. I consider this all part of the home is all part of the transition planning, how we're going to be living together in the interim, how we're going to be transitioning into a different ownership. You know, there's a lot that goes into a home. Okay, so these are just techniques in ways in a calm way.

that you can get what you want in terms of getting that conversation started, as it relates to where you are. Because right now you're living in the home, and this is where you're having a problem. He wants to talk about the home; the home is part of this conversation. So you need to be able to compromise and collaborate in terms of both getting what you want in that discussion. So you could say that too. OK, well, the home is

Part of what I want to talk about as well. So we're both on the same page there, but part of the home is how we are going to manage this transition. So if we can agree that the home is where we're going to start, but we want to be able to cover both of our bases, something that is important to what I want to talk about in the immediate, as well as what you want to talk about in the immediate. Just tools in your toolbox.

So I just finished the book Super Communicators, and part of one of the things I got out of it, I'm actually listening to it on audiobook,o and this checking for understanding is like a key element of this entire book. It's just getting clarity, getting a better understanding, asking the questions, and reiterating the act of listening is, know, Gottman.

101, right? It's checking for understanding, active listening, and making sure you're not jumping to conclusions. Because in your head, you're already making up stories in your head, right? When he's talking about what you believe he means, but you haven't asked him. You just immediately like, he doesn't want to deal with this, blah, blah, blah, blah, right?

The more active you are in it, the more you're going to be re-scripting as he's answering, right? I'm just trying to check for understanding why this is important to you that we don't talk about this right now.

Your stories are gonna be completely re-scripted as he's speaking, as he's speaking. The more information you get, the less you're gonna make up stories in your head.

(: 09:09

I

Tania Leichliter (: 09:09

The next portion of our support group discussion is something that comes up very often in coaching. And it comes up very often at the beginning of this separation. And it's this fear around not being with your kids every day. And depending on what your role has been within your married life, whether you're the primary caregiver, the concept and idea that your kids need you, or you want to be there for the kids, is something that comes up often. And I think that sometimes we need to re-script in our head what being there for the kids means.

Because when you move into a shared custody agreement, whether it's 50-50 or 70-30, that other individual is going to need to learn how to

Be there for the kids. So one of the things that I suggest is that when you are still living under the same roof, you consider a transition plan where you are doing an on-duty, off-duty week. Meaning that you have days of the week that you are on duty for the kids. So maybe Monday and Tuesday, Mom is on duty.

On Wednesday and Thursday, Dad is on duty, and maybe you alternate the weekends, or maybe you alternate days on the weekends. So one weekend, somebody has Friday night. The following week, the other person has Saturday night. But this gives the kids that feeling that they can have their individual parents all to themselves for those specific days. That is really important because

Your kids need the space just like you need the space from each other. So if you are living under the same roof, you are probably living on top of each other. You are probably feeling like you're walking on eggshells. You probably do everything to avoid each other. And your kids are going to feel that. They're not going to be able to be themselves. So being there for the kids means that you should be trying to provide them with the space that they need to have a relationship with each of the individual parents.

The other thing is it's a beautiful transition plan to what might be coming ahead, meaning that if you do end up having the kids go back and forth between two different homes, this begins to give them that sense of what it may feel like when one parent is in charge. And that parent who is on duty during the transition plan, maybe living under the same roof, well, they get a taste of what it feels like to be a solo parent during that time.

I know that the fears are around, my gosh, I'm not gonna get to see my kids every day. But even when you do have a custody plan, a parenting plan, when one parent is the primary parent for those specific days,

It doesn't mean that you don't get to go to their sporting events. And it doesn't mean that you don't get to lean on each other in times of need. Maybe something comes up at work, and one parent needs the other one to take over and actually pick up the kids from an activity.

And if that other parent is available to do that, you do that with open arms, and you're welcoming the opportunity to spend that additional time with your children. So again, adopting this on duty, off duty.

A parenting plan, while you are living under the same roof, is good for everyone. So again, listen to some of the coaching that I did live about these transition plans around the on-duty off-duty while you are living under the same roof.

(: 13:01

When you say you're not there for the kids? You don't want to give yourself the space that you need right now to be a better version of yourself, so you can show up better for yourself and for your kids, because you believe if you leave the house, you're not going to be there for the kids. So let's talk about being there for the kids. Let's talk about what being there for the kids means to you.

Because I think that there might be a solution in here if we talk through that. Because I do believe that right now, and it sounds like your therapist agrees, your situation right now is very toxic, and it's toxic for your children. So being there for your kids means thinking about the environment that they're in and making sure that they can be in a safe environment where they don't feel this way.

So there are lots of things. It sounds like being there for the kids, or might be carpooling and cooking, and, you know, doing day-to-day activity stuff. Is there a way to be able to be there physically for the kids to get their needs met, but still allow for some emotional space to be there so they are not getting exposed to what you're talking about, which is really harmful for them, you know, and you know that.

So, what is more important, the fact that they're getting food on the table or that they are being protected from any long-term emotional trauma? You know, so, you know, can you guys think about a solution?

that might be able to marry both of those needs.

Is there like some sort of middle ground?

He was on duty on Wednesday, Thursday, and then we alternated every other weekend, every other Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. And, you know, it worked when he worked from the house. So he worked from the house on Wednesdays and Fridays. So again, it worked really well that he was on duty those days, because he could take care of a lot of the kid stuff. And it really, really helped, because then on...

You know, I was still living under the same roof, but on Wednesdays and Thursdays, I just made plans. I went and had a running group, and I made plans with my friends, and I would still wander in at like eight 30 at night. But it was like after dinner and after the kids had kind of gone back to their rooms to do like where I scroll on, whatever they scroll on kind of thing. But think about a transition plan. Think about how you can provide some space. This on-duty, off-duty really does work, because it gives you.

That space you need, and it says like, I can still live here, but I don't have to be here all the time, always tending to the kids' needs, right? He has gonna have some responsibility for those things that you have always done. Because guess what? If he has any joint custody, he's gonna have to learn to do those things anyway.

covers both of his wants. So he said custody, and he said house. Okay, this transition planning covers custody because it is getting you in the habit and the practice of what it's going to feel like when you do have a shared custody plan. It literally will fold right in. So whatever you're thinking of for that kind of shared custody.

It can fold right in from a transition plan, even though you're under the same roof. We moved it right into it, right? We have exactly the same schedule as we had when we were on-duty, off-duty in the house. It's exactly the same. So the kids got used to it when we were under the same roof, and then we moved right into it when we were not under the same roof. So again, for the kids, not just for you guys.

They even have a printed thing that we did. Like we wrote it out. Like it was set in stone. It was part of our separation agreement, actually, that we had typed up to be like, hey, we're formally separated even though we're living under the same roof. This is what we're doing in terms of our transition plan for the kids. We've created an on-and-off-duty schedule. What the responsibilities are on and off duty were also outlined very clearly.

with the intent that the kids would then have a very nice transition into a more formal custody agreement. Like I said, we nested, so we ended up floating in and out of the house, so the kids really did kind of move right into it. Again, that is also something you could consider: one year of nesting, and when you're not in the house, you're with your parents. ⁓

You guys could consider that my most recent episode on my podcast was with a good friend of mine, and she and her husband just nested for one year. And then they moved. It was great for the kids because by the time they got to having to move households, it was a nice segue into having to move back and forth. They're like, OK, now we've gotten used to our parents not being under the same roof. I've gotten used to the

different changing of the guards, we used to call it. My kids are calling it the changing of the guards. Like, oh wait, who's coming in? Is Dad coming in tonight? If you put your kids first in the sense of what it is going to feel like for them? I feel like all of a sudden, your creative juices are gonna start flowing a little bit better. And him too, like, okay, let's just pretend we're our children from.

You know, what is this going to feel like for them? And we want it to be as smooth as possible. So let's start with this transition plan, this on and off duty. And of course, you and I can get used to it. Okay, well, maybe we need to adjust the dates. Maybe we like instead of the two, two, three, or it's really a two, five. Cause when you have a long weekend, it's either you're getting the two days before or you're getting the two days after. So you're really doing two days off, five days on.

That's basically how it is, which is doable.

Which is doable. And again, it's so hard to imagine not seeing your kids every day. I know, but once you get into that movement, it, it, you'll get into the group and you're going to see them all the time. I mean, you really do. I still saw my kids every day. They played sports. They had other activities. I was still on the sidelines. You've got FaceTime.

You'll realize you will end up seeing and communicating with them every day. It's just that even in the transition planning, it's not what you think it is. But it's also good for you to be able to say on a Monday night, like, my God, I don't even have to think about dinner tonight. Like, I can just go and do something that's going to clear my head.

And that's what that on-duty off-duty plan is going to provide you. It's just going to provide you with that space to be with the kids by yourself. Yeah. And so all I can tell you about mediation is be very prepared when you go in. Like, don't go in thinking you're going to come up with a solution there. You come in with an offer. Okay, you come in with a structure and you have a starting point.

So your starting point is this transition plan, this idea around on and off duty. You can find parenting plans, a million of them, either through ChatGPT or online, about different ways that traditional parenting plans, and then just move that into living under the same roof. Because you can do whatever you can do in a parenting plan, still live under the same roof. Define the duties that you believe the on-duty person is going to be responsible for.

present that. You present that at mediation as a starting point. You know that it's going to be a collaborative effort, but don't get in there with nothing. Don't be like, don't just go in there being like, hey, we need to talk about a transition plan. I have spent time thinking about what would potentially be a great segue

to a custody parenting plan agreement. I think we could start this with a transition plan where we're kind of modeling what it might look and feel like when we're not living under the same roof. And I've put together two or three different scenarios in terms of what an on-duty, off-duty plan.

would be it's going to be great for the kids because they're going to get individual time with each of us. And it'll be good for us because it'll allow us the space that we need right now to really grieve and be able to be more productive and move forward with our own mental health. And just say, these are just some starting points. And I'm hoping we can move from these into a productive conversation. walk into mediation with nothing.

because it's just a waste of your money. Like, even when you get into dividing the assets, don't start with nothing. Come in with a plan. Come in with some offers. And that's why working with a certified divorce financial analyst is really great because especially if you're worried about the house, you need someone who's going to give you three different scenarios or two different scenarios and offer that you can present.

to how assets can be split. I went ahead and hired a certified divorce financial analyst just because I've never dealt with the finances before. And so I just wanted a fresh look at what he was doing and what that division of assets was gonna look like for me over the next 30 years.

I want to get you prepped for each one of those mediation sessions. And I want to make sure that you feel very confident with what you're presenting, because that's part of it. It's going to be how you present it, the language by which you use it as you present it. Let's get you completely ready and feeling like you can do this. You're not going to control how he's going to react, but the mediator is going to be there to calm him down and to make sure he's not.

coming at you in a way that is combative, she'll fix that. But if you're overly prepared, I guarantee you, he is not going to be overly prepared on the same things. He might come in with the financial structure, and he might be prepared there. But if you work with a CDFA, he might not actually realize how prepared you're going to be coming in, and that's just going to benefit you a lot if you really educate yourself

Tania Leichliter (: 22:51

So thank you for tuning in to this episode about transition planning and living under the same roof, and how to start your mediation process. A couple of the things you should have taken away from this live coaching session are one, that if you stay focused on the problems and not on the solutions, you're gonna continue to spin your wheels. We talked very specifically.

about what a transition plan might look like, establishing an on-duty, off-duty parenting plan that still puts you and your soon-to-be ex under the same roof. We also talked about making sure that you follow the active listening methodology and don't jump to conclusions.

asking that individual, what I hear you saying is X. Is that what you meant? I'm trying to establish some clarity so I can make sure that we are on the same page. Active listening is going to be one of the key communication tools, so you can gather as much information as possible. So you can figure out what the alignment is

versus the misalignment.

Thank you for tuning in. I hope that you all consider joining us in our support group. I really appreciate your time. Check us out at betterthanbitter.coach. And I hope to see all of you take advantage of our free support group trial.

Tania Leichliter (: 24:14

Thanks for tuning in to Better Than Bitter, navigating an amicable divorce. Whether you are at the beginning of your divorce journey, midway through, or even done, we want the stories from our guests to give you hope that an amicable resolution is possible. If you'd like to dive deeper into today's episode, check out our show notes for a full transcript, reflections, and links to learn more about Better Than Bitter's coaching courses,

and how to connect with our fabulous guests. If you're ready for more support, you can head over to betterthanbitter.coach. Daily, you'll find details and additional information on our five-step game plan multimedia course, our one-to-one Zoom coaching, group coaching, monthly memberships, events and retreats, and a whole lot more. Plus, we've got a ton of free resources, like our monthly newsletter,

our private Facebook group, Instagram channel, and a library of articles and free webinars to help you along the way. When you go to our website, you'll be able to schedule a free 45-minute breakthrough call. Remember, we're here to help you reach an amicable resolution. Find your courage and believe in your brighter future because you know what? It is possible.

At Better Than Bitter, we measure success by what we give and not by what we get. So let's change the divorce dialogue together. It's time to be better than bitter.